tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post5287448316215881259..comments2023-10-26T06:29:39.824-07:00Comments on The Magnes Zionist: Should Universities Discipline Faculty Members for Calling for an Academic Boycott of Their Own Institution?Jerry Haberhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15173892714754718716noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-32635051976084904132010-08-15T22:32:42.942-07:002010-08-15T22:32:42.942-07:00What academic price is Gordon willing to pay? He i...What academic price is Gordon willing to pay? He is tenured. You have tenure. Your job is protected, your speech is protected, your income is protected. Yet you think nothing of damaging your colleagues incomes and careers or your institution's ability to function. All of this while your institution educated Arab Israelis and probably Palestinian Arabs as well. You should be deeply, deeply ashamed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-69972107363172969022010-08-05T09:18:08.965-07:002010-08-05T09:18:08.965-07:00That was a very well made argument. Consider me co...That was a very well made argument. Consider me convinced.Yossi Gurvitzhttp://www.hahem.co.il/friendsofgeorge/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-84465730440943267622010-08-04T08:44:03.643-07:002010-08-04T08:44:03.643-07:00Jerry,
"CEO and its most influential spokes...Jerry,<br /><br />"CEO and its most influential spokesman" - really?<br /><br /><br />And last time I checked Elvis was still alive – send him my regards next time you speak with him.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-60473635235050031822010-08-03T15:07:44.580-07:002010-08-03T15:07:44.580-07:00jerry,
some stayed...many left
those that stayed...jerry,<br /><br />some stayed...many left<br /><br />those that stayed were indeed cowards<br /><br />fine...dont leave the country<br /><br />and dont leave the university<br /><br />but stop taking what you perceive as blood money<br /><br />work for free<br /><br />not that it matters anyway...the bds movement is an epic failure<br /><br />it is just an extension of the arab boycott which has been in existence since 67....and what has it accomplished?<br /><br />well, elvis costello wont play israel (that wouldve been a big deal 10-20 years ago)<br /><br />but israel is one of the few countries that has weathered the global depression<br /><br />the bds movement has been slapped down on all major college campuses across the united states <br /><br />and recent polling shows that a majority of americans still stand with israel<br /><br />but go ahead jerry...you and neve should keep banging your heads against that proverbial wallAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-47979822593615370302010-08-03T13:58:19.501-07:002010-08-03T13:58:19.501-07:00The anonymous who said that "Magnes was never...The anonymous who said that "Magnes was never considered a Zionist in his lifetime" doesn't know his elbow from his derriere. "Magnes was the secretary of the Federation of American Zionists, its CEO and its most influential spokesman." (Dissenter in Zion, A. Goren)Jerry Haberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15173892714754718716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-51577299078265110162010-08-03T13:51:14.866-07:002010-08-03T13:51:14.866-07:00Yossi,
I don't agree with you at all on this ...Yossi,<br /><br />I don't agree with you at all on this one.<br /><br />It would be hypocritical for a professor to get grants from the government to work in tandem with IDF researchers, and then endorse a boycott against his university because it works with IDF.<br /><br />But it is not hypocritical to draw a salary from an institution and then call for a boycott of the institution because parts of it enable the Occupation, or to endorse academic boycott in order to end the Occupation. Neither are you directly benefiting from the unethical behavior, nor are you trying to destroy your university. <br /><br />Even in South Africa, where there were various levels of boycotts and sanctions against universities, most faculty members saw them as symbolic and as irritants; the universities themselves did not suffer greatly.<br /><br />On the contrary, when somebody like Neve Gordon calls for qn academic boycott the dramatic, symbolic impact is greater, because of the is willing to pay the academic price, both in his institution, and in his profession, of being at that institution.<br /><br />The "hypocritical" argument is often misused. I remember when opponents of the Vietnam War were told that they were hypocritical to live in America and pay taxes, which went to the war effort, and criticize the war. I am accused of being hypocritical because I live in Israel and criticize it. If I really was serious in my criticism, I am told, I would leave. <br /><br />Those calling for an academic boycott are not hypocritical, nor are they cowards; the cowards are the ones who agree with them but shut up for fear of reprisals, and there are many of them in all universities.<br /><br />I still have not said that I endorse the academic boycott, though. That is a much more complex question. But I don't consider those academics who do worthy of sanction or hypocritical.Jerry Haberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15173892714754718716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-57327376272488415872010-08-03T13:34:09.132-07:002010-08-03T13:34:09.132-07:00bacci40,
You are wrong about South Africa; there ...bacci40,<br /><br />You are wrong about South Africa; there were academics that supported boycott and sanctions and stayed at their institutions. <br /><br />"The ethical and other issues surrounding the academic boycott deeply divided the academic community, both within and outside South Africa. Boycott proponents argued that academics should not be treated as an elite detached from the political and social environment in which it functions, especially since some of the South African universities seemed to be tools of the Nationalist government." <br /><br />from The Academic Boycott of South Africa: Symbolic Gesture or Effective Agent of Change?<br />by F. W. Lancaster (University of Illinois at Urbana- Champaign) and Lorraine Haricombe (Northern Illinois University)<br /><br />Many academics did not support it, and many resented it.Jerry Haberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15173892714754718716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-77389632642103321742010-08-03T12:44:04.063-07:002010-08-03T12:44:04.063-07:00@Yossi Gurvitz
I think a university ought to be b...@Yossi Gurvitz<br /><br />I think a university ought to be bigger than the narrow views of its administrators. As long as Neve Gordon is within Ben Gurion University, then his (brilliant) minority voice is part of that university. It's not hypocracy, it's teaching. Conflicts exist within the broad church that is a university.willyrobinsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03632164604591555951noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-48689054845828546922010-08-03T10:52:03.967-07:002010-08-03T10:52:03.967-07:00bacci40,
what you are saying is really a wishful ...bacci40,<br /><br />what you are saying is really a wishful thinking on your part - the crowd you dealing with will never sacrifice their comfort for their convictions. even the author of this blog while preaching the "magnes" kind of zionism (never mind that magnes was never considered to be a zionist in his lifetime) did not mind to have a tenure at bar-ilan (or so he claims). the same goes for the rest of this crowd - only once they secure more cushy jobs overseas will they leave (and then will continue to besmirch their former employers at every opportunity). and i agree with you yossi gurvitz the key element here is moral cowardice.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-24438172767775337612010-08-02T22:41:30.706-07:002010-08-02T22:41:30.706-07:00I think there's an issue which wasn't addr...I think there's an issue which wasn't addressed, which is moral cowardice. To call for the boycotting of a university since it is a collaborator of the occupation and still draw a salary from it is morally indefensible. If the crimes of the university are so great you are morally obliged to call for its boycott, do the essential thing and resign. <br /><br />For the record, I support a boycott on the universities. I just think it hypocritical in the extreme for a faculty member to do so.Yossi Gurvitzhttp://www.hahem.co.il/friendsofgeorge/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7675600882597316438.post-70240114777136638182010-08-02T15:57:37.448-07:002010-08-02T15:57:37.448-07:00oh please
if you and the rest of the so called ac...oh please<br /><br />if you and the rest of the so called academics truly had the courage of your convictions, you would do as they did in south africa<br /><br />resign your positions and leave the countryAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com